To solder all or not to solder all

FriscoKid
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My apologies if this has been covered ad nauseum before. I plan to use a combination of Atlas sectional and flextrack, plus Peco turnouts, on my new layout. It will initially be under DC control, morphing to DCC shortly. My question concerns the advice that "every piece of track should be soldered to something". It will be a smallish layout ( 3.5 x 7.5 ) so there won't be a huge amount of trackage, or connections for that matter. The layout will be in a bedroom, so temperature fluctuations and track expansion/contraction should be be minimal. What are your thoughts and/or experiences in soldering each track section (excepting turnouts) and running feeders every 4 feet or so? Overkill or smart thinking?


PennsyPride
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
I personally don't solder track sections except for flex sections in a curve. It doesn't hurt to solder a feeder to every section of track, but can be very time consuming....you may want to put a feeder wire every 6 feet or so and run some trains. If you notice slow and/or problem spots add additional feeders as needed.
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tedbtrains
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
I found out (the hard way) that if I am going to have a power or lack of power problem it will at a turn out. I fixed this problem by soldering my feeder wires to the turn out, that way the power seams to flow thru with out any hesitation. Soldering the whole layout esp one that size might be overkill. Just my two cents Ted
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FriscoKid
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
That sounds like a good idea - having my feeders dropped from the turnout throats. Thanx for the 2-cents-worth


tedbtrains
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
A word of caution...be sure to use heat sinks. I use wet (damp) cotten balls placed on the track on each side of the area that I am soldering. That way you will not melt the ties, also tin your feeder wire tips first. They will hold better and adhere to the track faster. A little bit of flux helps to. Another two cents worth. Ted
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There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Mental Illness"




FriscoKid
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
I usually use alligator clips as heat sinks. How about using electronic solder with flux core? Or is seperate flux preferable?


tedbtrains
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
Clips are good, anything to pull the heat away is fine. I use a very fine rosen core solder that I can only seam to find at Radio Smack. I still brush a fine coat of flux on the area, then after it has cooled I clean it with denatured alcohol. After much expermentation and messed up track ties, the fluxing seamed to fix my soldering problems. I use Ruby Flux. Ted
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There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Mental Illness"




Spoon
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
Just to chime in, it might be overkill, but I solder everything. I've never had a problem with power, or with turnouts. I run feeder wires every three feet and I feed every turnout. My first layout was 3'x6', my second was a 10'x10' "L" and now I'm working on an 18'x30' basement. It does take more time but I think it's worth it.


BryanC
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
Hi rwcorleyze We just had a thread covering related information. Maybe you saw it? :wink: http://www.nscale.net/PNphpBB2-viewtopic-t-4259.html For whatever it's worth I haven't soldered a d**n thing. Where flextrack joins came on curves, I inserted a piece of curved Unitrack to avoid the curved join. So far it's worked very well although I suspect I'll end up wishing otherwise at some point! Touch wood, only very minor electrical problems (on my 3 x 6) so far! :roll:
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Cheers!

Bryan C
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rbarnes1
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
Well rwcorleyze, I like the cut of Spoon's jib! I too soldered every joint, with feeders every 4 feet, and soldered "power" to my frogs! Unlike the rest of these experienced old and young timers, I figured anything I was going to sink the next two years of my life building and hundreds and hundreds of dollars into had better be first class! Not having any acquaintances who actually build MRRs to get pointers from, I had to take what sounded good from everything I could read in MRR books and glean from this website. I love my 4'x8' layout, I love my DCC power, and I love this hobby! Remember, we don't do this to be speedy, or especially time efficient. We do it because we love it. And the thing you need to be asking yourself is, what is the "best" way of building your MRR layout? Just my 2 cents thrown into the pond of knowledge! Or is that mud? :lol: Ryan


Cornreaper
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Re:To solder all or not to solder all
Every joint soldered here too....and feeders every 3 feet as well as on every joint of every turnout. I only have about 35' of track on a door, so it wasn't too bad, but still took a while....and worth every second. I used sectional, so what I did was pre-soldered all the straight sections so they'd be perfectly straight when I laid them down, then after all track was installed and the curves were worked out, I did them too Also, for what it's worth, I seem to have achieved soldering zen, as I don't use heat sinks, and I haven't melted a single tie. All i do is dig the tip right into the joint for 20 seconds, touch it it with some 60/40 rosin core, let it flow into the rail joiner and remove.


WillPac
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Feedback would be

Feedback would be appreciated:  would I be better off soldering to the track itself (I have read, in Kalmbach books no less, that N scale is too small for reliable soldering) or should I solder the wire to the rail joiners, to make something similar to Atlas' Terminal Joiners that go for $2.75 a pair?


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Ron S.

Willamette Pacific Railroad




ranulf
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Solder feeders to the track

Solder feeders to the track and forget about what the HOe scalers in Waukesha say (on that point, at least).  If you're worried about your skills, pick up an extra piece of flex track and practice joints on it until you're comfortable.  Unless you're soldering those terminal joiners to the track, you will not have a solid connection anyway. 

Just my two cents. 


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Bryan
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Ron, I would have to

Ron, I would have to disagree with the Kalmbach comment... it's a matter of having suitable tools and technique... nothing out of the reach of the majority, with a little practice... search the forums and you'll find a couple of instances where the tools and techniques are discussed...

Soldering to a rail-joiner does not alleviate the potential for continuity issues between the joiner and the rails...


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Bryan




Michael
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Boo to Kalmbach

WillPac wrote:
(I have read, in Kalmbach books no less, that N scale is too small for reliable soldering)

That's a rather surprising comment!  I'm not sure how the K-folk decided that N was too small for reliable soldering, but either way I believe they're wrong.  Soldering is a simple art that with a practice you suddenly 'get'.  Depending on your iron, the tip, the solder, and the track, there is going to be a 'best' approach that will yield perfect results.  I've had no issues soldering track, but after assembling circuit boards and fixing the plumbing in the house its possible I've amassed an inordinate amount of experience.  As suggested, practice on some scraps and learn your iron - it won't take many attempts before you understand how long to heat the rails before you give it a kiss of solder.




pantoine
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Joined: 2008-02-09
Soldering tips and tricks...

Here's what I've learned in soldering n scale track:

  • Use .5mm solder (very fine) with flux core... the solder to flux ratio is higher in the thinner solder
  • Use a temperature-controlled 40W or more soldering iron with a fine tip.  Such irons are more expensive than the usual 15W cheapies from Tandy/Radio Shack etc. but are worth every penny!  They last longer, the tips are replaceable and they provide a *very* hot tip which makes a joint *faster* thus (unintuitively) reducing the heat transfered to the rail/ties. I bought a temperature controlled iron for $AU79 (approx. $US70.)
  • Keep the tip tinned and *clean*. Use a wet sponge to wipe tip of exces/old flux and solder.
  • Lightly abraid the point on the rail to which you'll be soldering. This removes any corrosion and gives a good clean surface for the flux.
  • Use a NON-corrosive flux.  These can be harder to find but can usually be had at more specialised electronics suppliers.
  • Apply flux to joint surface
  • Tin the  rail *quickly* using the highest temp your iron will put out.
  • Tin the wire by applying solder and tip to the *base* of the stripped wire right where the insulation sits.  This will ensure that the solder wicks up the wire underneath the insulation in addition to wicking out towards the stripped end. The result is a very mechanically secure wire because the solder wicked up under the insulation acts as a strain relief.
  • Apply tip, solder and tinned wire to the tinned rail.  Complete the joint as quickly as possible without moving the wire as it cools (you can blow on the joint to speed cooling.)


I wire every single piece of rail and the rails and frogs of a point such that there are droppers under the layout.  This makes adding blocks much easier later! Admittedly I use flex track exclusively so your mileage may vary.

P. 




a_batey
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Posts: 71
Joined: 2007-07-06
Just thought i would say we

Just thought i would say we have recently finished soldering every track joint on our club layout. It is a decent size layout but unsure of its length in feet but it has taken myself and 4 other people 3 hours every monday night for the past 6 months or more to do so. It was not done when the layout was built with some sections of it being over 20 years old we began to get voltage drops across the joints and affecting the reliability of the system.

So lesson learned and our HO club layout under construction we will do this during construction.

 Cheers


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