Wireless Train Controller

Thanks for that info, Kerry.  I thought the DCC system used a method of 'overlaying' the control signals over the 12V supply.  I've used a 12V motor control system designed for another purpose...modified the code in the AVR and now have a train controller.  I was looking to improve that with wireless technology where I basically put 12V on the track and use it for anything else on the layout that can use it while my console is talking to the train via wireless technology.

I would certainly like some opinions on this sort of system.  If anyone has run across something like this please let me know as I would hate to work on something only to find out 'the wheel's already invented'...

 

Sounds like a good idea you've got, but as Bryan stated, not practical (currently) in this small scale.  No room to stuff the decoder and receiver.  But to be honest, this would add additional complexity (and cost) that isn't needed.  The current DCC systems accomplish what you want and more.  From your wireless controller (assuming you have everything wired for it), you can control any swtich on your layout, monitor its position, control all the functions of every lococmotive on the layout, monitor and control a signalling system and get feedback on the location of every lococmotive on the layout.  As I eluded to earlier, the systems truly give you the chance to operate the trains, not worrying about where locomotives are, or what power block they're in, etc, etc.  For anything bigger than a small loop, they make wiring a much simpler (and less costly) proposition.  And the costs associated with the equipment are nearly a wash today.  You can buy decoder-equiped locos on eBay for less than you'd pay for a non-decoder equipped version at your local hobby shop (or LHS as you see them refered to here).

Anyway, not to discourage your efforts, but if it is N scale you desire you're sort of pursuing the reinvention of the wheel.....  Suggest you make a point of getting a demonstration of  DCC system.  I suspect once you see how fun it is running trains, not track, you'll be hooked.

Kerry

What you want is a wireless throttle made by Crest (formerly Aristocraft).  I believe they call it the "Train Engineer.  What you get when you buy it is a handheld throttle and a receiver.

You'll  need a power supply (12VDC) which you'll use as an input, but you won't need any other hardware.

 You will also need to check to make sure there is a frequency which has been aproved for use in Austrailia (I'm not sure there is).

These were originally design for large scale garden railroads, but I know many N-trak groups (including my own) use them for DC control of trains.

Paul 

The closest thing I have seen that would work in N-scale uses infrared receivers inside the locomotive, of course the sensor for the receiver has to be visible. The system is made by Rail-Lynx(http://www.rail-lynx.com/) and they do have a receiver for N-scale, although they are still bigger than most N-scale DCC receivers. RF straight to the locomotive is certainly doable, but if you are still relying on the rails for power I don't see what the advantage over DCC would be.

Other than the fractured English... it still seems to be canted towards the larger scales, particularly the many 'G' scales. (20.3 to 29:1).

For indoors N (can you imagine N outdoors???), all I would want is for the DCC decoder to remember the last command for the second or so that the flywheels would keep moving the train to a clean section of track.

Even at that, if the signal is interupted longer than the latency of the command station output stream, I think I'd rather the train stopped so I knew there was a problem, rather than some tripple redundant system that worked till things were totally fubared.

 

Bob in IDaho

 

 

All I'm running my single train with is a DC motor controller.  I've programmed the AVR to do forward and reverse in several speeds and couple of other buttons programmed to slow stop and emergency stop.  I use a 12V battery booster to power this and track...you'll get about 18hrs of play time on this thing before you need a recharge.

I've read in places where there are problems with DCC.....not many but they are there.  Like flickering lights and other things.  I want a system that uses a clean 12VDC supply to run all power on a layout.  Including any accessories I might want later.  A bench top supply can do something like this easily.

As far as battery operation...well battery is okay as long as it isn't inside the loco.....

Rudee, that's I was trying to get at... what's the purpose/advantage of direct wireless control unless you're not relying on the rails as your power supply?... ie. have a battery in the loco...

Flickering lights with DCC is a sign of poor track/wheel cleanliness... like anything, if you don't do your maintenance, it wont work at its best... the same ultimately applies to DC operation, it just doesn't show up as soon... reinventing the wheel rather than cleaning it seems like a major undertaking, especially considering the size constraints.

Ruddee,
 
As MICROCZEK said, in DCC power is continuously applied to the track.  Maybe you have figured it out now, but from your earliest posts you seemed to feel that there was still a variable voltage applied to the track with a control signal applied on top of this.  The DCC squarish wave serves two purposes.  It is an AC power supply, and a binary encoded data signal.  The squarish wave pulse width varies for binary 1's and 0's.
 
One of the decoder's jobs is to provide a DC supply for the motor from the DCC AC power.
 
If you haven't already figured this all out,
Charles

What problems are you talking about?



Yes, it could work, but it would cost more than DCC and I don't see any advantages since you are still relying on the track for power.

MooseID,
 
If you are referring to a pulsed DC controller as causing problems and why there are not these problems with DCC, it is as I indicated.  Part of the job of the decoder is to take the DCC AC power and convert it to DC power used by the decoder electronics, and the motor, etc.  (Though strictly speaking as far as I can tell the decoders can produce pulsed DC to the motor for improved low speed response, similar to a pulsed DC controller, which is different from back EMF.)
 
Note that in DCC the only thing in the loco that needs to be connected to the track is the decoder (yea through the wheels...).  Basically, the track is on one side of the decoder, and the motor, lights etc. are on the other side of the decoder (so to speak).
 
Charles

"a pest", not at all... we're more than happy to indulge in the evaluation of a concept...

Multiple wireless control of a layout can be done with DCC... power requirements for t/o control depends on the t/o motor used, but certainly is not restricted to 16VAC... with PECO's you're better off using CDU's which you can charge from a DC or AC source... Tortoise run on 12VDC... many folks prefer to use separate power supplies for t/o control and accessory / lighting use, so as to not burden their loco power supply, and to simplify faultfinding... it also avoids loosing everything is one system goes down.

Whilst what you're proposing doesn't seem to be offering any new benefits, I can certainly appreciate the DiY tinkering aspect (being an Aussie boy from the bush with the occasional inventive flare)...

There are those that choose to DiY DCC circuits, and I remember there being a few web pages dealing with this approach... let me know if that hold interest, and I'll see what I can dig up...

In any event, keep us posted on your endeavours.