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Thread: UR92 / LNWI living together?

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    Default UR92 / LNWI living together?

    At a show this weekend we had our UR92 giving us problems, we recently added a LNWI to the system.

    It was like the UR92 was transmitting but not receiving.. The LNWI was working fine. We resolved the UR92 issue by doing a reset..

    At the club with a permanent layout the same thing happened. the LNWI has been running there for 3 weeks, if there was a problem with the UR92 I wasn't aware of it..
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    The two should be able to live together without issues. We have them mounted inches from each other on our communication tower.
    Peter

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    Our club uses both without any issue.
    Jerry

    If you haven't broken something along the way, you haven't learned anything.

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    One issue with IEEE 802.11 ( WiFi, which is used by the LNWI ) and IEEE 802.15.4 ( which is the radio transmission standard used by Digitrax Duplex throttles ) is that the radio channels used by each of them overlap. ( they both use the 2.4GHz Industrial Scientific Medical (ISM ) band, which means you don’t have to have a license to operate them ).

    It is likely that you have the devices set to bands that are overlapping. Try changing the channel used on one or both devices.

    For the UR92, JMRI includes a tool that can scan the channels for interference, which helps with channel selection:
    http://jmri.org/help/en/package/jmri...bedPanel.shtml

    ( I can pull up some links to more technical documentation on this with some nice graphs if you want, but I don’t have them handy... )

    Paul
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    Useful info for sure Paul. Thank you for sharing.
    GM50 4164
    Benjamin H

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    For a follow up..
    I changed the channels on the UR92s of both layouts, that seems to have corrected any problems we had..
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    If you dive into the Digitrax knowledge database for the LNWI, or browse around at the Digitrax groups.io site, there is guidance about setting the LNWI and UR92. Basic info is that the LNWI channel needs to be ten off of the UR92 channel (e.g., if your duplex group channel is 14, the Wi-Fi channel should be 4). This does limit the UR92 as the LNWI doesn't have as many available channels.

    http://www.digitrax.com/tsd/KB1053/lnwi-advanced-options/

    Sam

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    Quote Originally Posted by samusi01 View Post
    If you dive into the Digitrax knowledge database for the LNWI, or browse around at the Digitrax groups.io site, there is guidance about setting the LNWI and UR92. Basic info is that the LNWI channel needs to be ten off of the UR92 channel (e.g., if your duplex group channel is 14, the Wi-Fi channel should be 4). This does limit the UR92 as the LNWI doesn't have as many available channels.
    Too bad that doesn’t always work.

    If you use Chanel 1 on Wi-Fi and channel 11 on IEEE 802.15.4, the two channels overlap.

    Here is one of several articles on the subject that includes a nice graphic of the channels.
    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1155/2011/912152
    ( see figure 6 ).

    The best bet is a actually to use one of WiFi channels 1,6, or 11 and IEEE 802.15.4 channels 15,20,25, or 26. Even if all of these channels are active, there is no overlap.

    For those of us who take layouts to train snows, if all 11 available WiFi channels are in use, they actually can crowd out IEEE 802.15.4.

    Paul
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    Quote Originally Posted by samusi01 View Post
    Basic info is that the LNWI channel needs to be ten off of the UR92 channel (e.g., if your duplex group channel is 14, the Wi-Fi channel should be 4). This does limit the UR92 as the LNWI doesn't have as many available channels.

    http://www.digitrax.com/tsd/KB1053/lnwi-advanced-options/
    I believe that's not how to read that document. Rather, I think it's "if you set the LNWI WiFi channel by setting the Duplex Group channel with your throttle, it will be 10 apart. If you want a different result, use the CVs". Not exactly "it has to be 10 apart".

    I may be wrong, though, don't really have any experience with Digitrax Radio throttles.

    YMMV,
    Heiko

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    Heiko,

    You may well be correct. I don't recall if the Digitrax software set the channels ten apart or not. At any rate, Paul's linked graphic is an interesting depiction of the channels and worth thinking about for the next train show.

    Sam

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    One takeaway from this and another recent topic here on smartphone issues, is that with 1) LNWI 2) the knowledge that @pbender has shared and 3) a couple surplus Android phones still capable of Wi-Fi connectivity, a guy could have a decently reliable wireless Digitrax DCC system to run his layout.

    In the not too-distant past, I gave the whole idea of phone throttles down the road. Don't want the cell phone in the train room, unless I turn off the phone functionality entirely. I also like knobs and switches because I'm a tactile kind of guy.

    But a smartphone that's no longer a phone? Hmmm, I think I could adapt to that.

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    Could you use the phone as a locomotive phone as well as a throttle?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Schmidt View Post
    But a smartphone that's no longer a phone? Hmmm, I think I could adapt to that.
    That's what I've done: I use an old iPhone 4 and some sort of Android as my principle throttles. Most of the time I use JMRI as the host as doing so allows one to relabel function buttons to something more useful but I will use the LNWI when I don't want to bother firing up the layout laptop.

    As a side note, Apple doesn't allow programmers to access the volume buttons, unlike Android, so when I use Engine Driver on Android I tend to use the volume buttons to set throttle settings and WiThrottle gets the touch slider.

    About once every month or two I might use a duplex or wired digitrax throttle. Not too common.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Schmidt View Post
    In the not too-distant past, I gave the whole idea of phone throttles down the road. Don't want the cell phone in the train room, unless I turn off the phone functionality entirely. I also like knobs and switches because I'm a tactile kind of guy.
    If you want the buttons, here are three options for you:

    The ESU Mobile Control II:
    http://www.esu.eu/en/products/digita...le-control-ii/
    This is just an android device with a throttle knob built in. It will run EngineDriver app.

    The TCS Universal WiFi throttle:
    https://tcsdcc.com/throttle
    This is a purpose built throttle, but it talks the WiThrottle protocol

    There is also the protothrottle:
    http://www.protothrottle.com/
    Which is really cool. I want one, but don’t have the funds.
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    Or go into building one yourself...

    There's Geoff Bunza's project: https://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/35652
    There's my project: https://newheiko.github.io/wiFred

    And I believe there's a few more which I can't seem to find here at work. Gotta check my eMail archive when I'm back at home...

    Heiko

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