Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: UP Cab signals??

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    1,253
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 381 Times in 119 Posts
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    The CNW used this system before the UP takeover. Thusly all former CNW units will be equipped for it and I'm guessing all or most of the new engines UP has purchased since the takeover will be so equipped.

    Back in the late 1970s the Milwaukee Road and the CNW swapped ten SD45s between each other on account of the cab signal system. The Milwaukee Road had acquired trackage rights on the CNW line in Iowa in order to abandon or downgrade some of its own parallel line. The railroads swapped engines so the Milwaukee would have its own units equipped to lead on this segment of railroad.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Quincy, IL USA
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    Brian, would happen to know if the CNW used the ATC system wide on all their divisions or did they use this sporadically.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    1,253
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 381 Times in 119 Posts
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    I know it wasn't used on every line as the CNW had many secondary mains and branches that wouldn't warrant its expense. I don't know, however, which main lines it was used on across the system. The only one I can vouch for is the Chicago to Omaha main.

    One aspect of its use today is the run through power seen on CSX. Trains that originate on CSX that run directly onto UP trackage in Chicago (Or through a terminal road and onto UP tracks) are required to have a UP cab signal equipped engine leading or UP will not accept the train at interchange. This is why all trains that run through to the UP have UP power on CSX; this is not the case with the BNSF run through operations.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Quincy, IL USA
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    Thanks for the info. I am trying to find out more about this so I can follow the UP when I railfan there Omaha to Chicago mainline through Clinton, IA. It looks like UP was trying to make this a a both mainline run as they are putting Crossovers in and putting signals in until they hit a place about 15 miles west of Clinton. They are using movable frog switches with newer signals which look like the have been recently put in. Or did the CNW use these type switches and signals to on the also. this i think was called the UP geneva sub which is east of Clinton, IA.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    187
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    Jack,

    Union Pacific uses a combination of CTC (Centralized Traffic Control) and DT (Double Track) between Clinton and Omaha and ALL locomotives that run on the main line have cab signals in them.

    The DT areas of the track have no wayside signals as this is current of traffic territory. (Most DT is right handed however the DT areas between Chicago and Omaha are left handed!!!) The areas with wayside signals are CTC. Cab signals are used on the full length of UP's multiple mainline. Also the mainline from Clinton to Missouri Valley IA uses ATC (Automatic Train Control) which utilizes a different cab signal method and is used because of the heavy train traffic.

    Automatic Train Control will put the brakes on the entire train and bring it to a dead stop if the operater doesnt respond to the alerter within 6 seconds.

    ACS (Automatic Cab Signals) were used until the installation of ATC. ACS cab signals are very similar to the wayside signals in their aspects except a yellow over green is used in the cab where a flashing yellow is used at the wayside signal.

    However with the upgrade to ATC these cab signals are no longer used. ATC only has 2 cab signals. Green and Red & Yellow. Its either slow or go!!

    Both ACS and ATC provide real-time track info in the cab of the locomotive. There is an electric pulse that runs thru the rail and is read by sensors in front of the locomotive wheels, which activates the lights in the cab. This way, if you are delayed within a block and can not see the signal, the cab signal gives you real time block info.

    For example if the block you entered had a clear (green) signal indication and you stopped past the signal (ATC is good for that....worse when raining...AKA "Rain Control"...lol) and you still had a clear (green) light in the cab....you can still hi ball, without it you would have to move at restricted speed until the next signal.

    Hope that helps.........

    ( The Geneva sub runs from the yard office (directly under the 14th St. overpass) in Clinton to the east and the Clinton sub runs from the yard office in Clinton to the east side of Boone)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Quincy, IL USA
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    UP conductor, Thanks for your answers to my questions.

    Got a couple more questions for you. How far west does the CTC go west on the clinton sub. I know UP was planning making it all CTC at one time. as they have been putting in crossovers. That way faster trains can overtake slower ones. I think the last one west is at Brophy just before the park before it goes under US 30 before Dewitt, IA. Have they put the stops to converting the whole division.


    And I notice these crossovers are using movable point frogs on every crossover on the Geneva and Clinton subs have thses frogs. What are they and how do they work. I am kind of interested in these as I might want to model some of them. I know there is a switch machine for the points of the switch and switch machine for the frog. and they have both to be thrown for the train to go through the switch.

    But how is the frog thrown. Does the whole frog move side to side or does the frog rails slide back and forth like putting your hands together and rubbing them back and forth. This is the first time I have encountered a switch like that. and I am curious about it.

    Thanks

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    187
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    Lemme see here..........

    CTC currently ends at Brophy (CPA13) and Double Track begins. DT runs to Bertram IA where it goes back to CTC all the way to Beverly IA (Cedar Rapids). From Beverly to east Marshalltown is Double Track then it reverts back to CTC for the remainder of the Clinton Sub.

    High speed cross overs are still being put in and CTC is still planned for the whole Clinton Sub.....my guess.....maybe all CTC with in the next year.....maybe!!


    As far as movable point frogs........

    High speed crossovers require movable point frogs. These frogs are controlled by the dispatcher, same as the switches. If one must manually throw the switch and frog.....the frog works the same way as a hand thrown switch.
    As far as how a movable point frog works.........I would say your "putting your hands together and rubbing them back and forth" would be the easiest way to explain it.........thank God you came up with that........I would STILL be sitting here trying for figure out how to describe that one!!!

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Quincy, IL USA
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    Thanks for the info.

    One more question. As they moved the DT to CTC. Are they putting in signals with it. Or are they going to still use the ATC cab signals to relay signal info or use the combination of both.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    187
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    I am not sure....I will ask around and see if I can get an answer for you.

    There will always be ATC because of the heavy traffic and I am sure they will add wayside signals when they convert the DT to CTC.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Quincy, IL USA
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    Just wondering upconductor if they have done anymore to that division as far as Putting in more CTC on the Clinton Sub.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    187
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re:UP Cab signals??

    I am not sure as I have not been out there in about 4 months. I believe they have been adding high-speed crossovers in preparation for CTC.
    Lemme ask around........I will let you know what I find out!

Similar Threads

  1. Atlas Signals and DCC one year later. Anyone using them?
    By woodone in forum Turnout Control Devices, Signaling, & Detection.
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 15th Jan 2008, 10:54 AM
  2. DC blocks and signals
    By Bryan in forum Turnout Control Devices, Signaling, & Detection.
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 15th Feb 2007, 01:44 AM
  3. Where to place the signals
    By railohio in forum Turnout Control Devices, Signaling, & Detection.
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 19th Nov 2004, 08:06 AM
  4. CDA Electronics signals
    By sd80ns in forum Turnout Control Devices, Signaling, & Detection.
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 1st Jan 1970, 12:00 AM
  5. how to wire for new atlas n scale train signals
    By jrgaut in forum Layouts, Design, & Planning.
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 1st Jan 1970, 12:00 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •